Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Ariana Drummond: My father was a corporate executive and he said to me, you should do something that you would do even if you weren't going to get paid for it. And this is back in the early 90s and I had never heard that before and I thought, I like tv, I watch tv, I'm going to do tv. An executive producer has to be prepared to do anything and everything. I think that the really successful ones know how to do a wide range of things. The mission of the show, it really is just to show that different perspectives that exist in this world. But the part B of it is hopefully it'll promote change.
[00:00:35] Sheila Ducksworth: Every great show starts somewhere. Maybe it's a pitch or the exciting spark of a new partnership, but it always starts with someone who's willing to bet on a vision before it's proven. Today's guest has been that someone over and over again for over two decades.
Today we're joined by entertainment executive and powerhouse producer Sheila Ducksworth. When Sheila was just 10 years old, she fell in love with the soap opera genre.
A world full of high stakes drama, hidden secrets and the rise and fall of legacy families.
But she quickly realized that the families on screen never quite looked like her own.
But that didn't push Sheila away from the genre. It pulled her in deeper. She began her career at Big ticket Television in Los Angeles and went on to produce the landmark Showtime drama Soul Food which earned seven NAACP Image awards during its five season run. She built her own production company, Ducksworth Productions, and went on to lead television for some of the industry's biggest names, eventually becoming head of scripted television and production for Will Packer Media. Today, as president of the CBS Studios NAACP venture, Sheila has gone from being a consumer of the soap opera genre to becoming an architect of it. As the executive producer beyond the Gates. This is the first black led daytime soap opera to debut in over 25 years.
It has also earned two NAACP Image Awards nominations and 15 Daytime Emmy nominations in its first year. This conversation goes deep into her journey, her passion for the genre that raised her and what it takes to build a legacy that started as a childhood dream. I'm your host, Arianna Drummond. Welcome to NACP Inside the industry.
Sheila, welcome to NACP Inside the industry. How are you feeling today?
[00:02:22] Ariana Drummond: Great. Really good to be here.
[00:02:24] Sheila Ducksworth: Well, thank you so much for joining us. I'm super excited.
But before we jump into all things beyond the gates, I want to take a step back and talk about your beginning. So I know you've been watching soap opera since you were 10 years old and now you are an executive producer for the first soap opera to premiere in over 25 years, which is absolutely crazy.
So I have to ask you, when you're on set and the cameras are rolling, what do you think 10 year old Sheila would think about the life and the career that you've built?
[00:02:53] Ariana Drummond: I mean, it's incredible. I mean it has been amazing in every way and it's been a real journey because that is true since I was 10 and watching General Hospital and watching the EJE and I, it was just, you know, these worlds that you'd be transported and the stories were just so fantastic and they gave you such choices to really contemplate even as a 10 year old.
But now actually having the built something, actually having put together something that has been a dream of mine at such a young age, it is. I don't even know that I could put words to it.
[00:03:30] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that. I love that. And what I also love is that you didn't take a traditional path. I know you. That you grew up in New York and then you also went to Yale and you had a career or I'm sorry, and you majored in economics and political science.
When did you first realize that you wanted to go into entertainment?
[00:03:48] Ariana Drummond: You know, I didn't come upon that realization until after college.
So even in college I was surrounded by so many people who were in the arts and were doing so much, but I was really on a track for economics and political science and do I want to get into investment banking? Do I want to get and go to law school? There are a lot of different things that I was contemplating, but it was never one of being in the arts, I have to say.
But what ended up happening was I graduated from college and then I, I was coming up on my five year reunion.
So it was my first reunion out of college and at that point I was doing very well. I did choose banking. I was doing very well.
It was kind of all the trappings that might make one want to stay.
The big one was I had four weeks of vacation and because I was an officer, I was able to get two weeks back to back where it was mandatory. You had to take the two weeks. So I always was looking to go to the next place, do the next thing. And it was a great life and a great lifestyle.
But I went to my fifth year college reunion and I really thought about it and I came back from Connecticut to New York and thought about is this what I want to do at my 50th college reunion? And say, this is what I'VE done for basically all of my career.
And I decided that I wanted to do something different that was really interesting to me and my father, who was in the corporate space.
My mother is an educator. My father was a corporate executive. He said to me, you should do something that you would do even if you weren't going to get paid for it. And this is back in the early 90s. And I had never heard that before. I've since heard it quite a bit, but I had never heard it before. And I thought, I like tv, I watch tv, I'm going to do tv. So I went on a fact finding mission. I really had never been in California as an adult. I had never been. I was there as a teenager once for a trip.
But I went out and I kind of structured the whole week of what I was going to do and planned it out.
And truly, on the plane ride back from Los Angeles to New York, I mapped it out. I mapped out when I was gonna quit the job, how I was gonna save the money to get to the point at which I was gonna quit the job. I literally landed at that time there was an American Airlines kiosk that was right by Grand Central Station. And I literally went and bought a one way ticket and. And then I ended up coming to Los Angeles.
[00:06:24] Sheila Ducksworth: That's amazing.
[00:06:25] Ariana Drummond: It was all laid out.
[00:06:27] Sheila Ducksworth: And the fact that you had such a supportive system even back then, like, to your point, I think some people are very pushed to be like, okay, find a job, stick with it. But the fact that your dad was really open to you exploring other options is.
[00:06:38] Ariana Drummond: Well, the truth is they actually wanted me to stick with the job. They really didn't. They weren't big proponents of me leaving and going 3,000 miles away.
But they're just so terrific. If it's something that I wanted to try, they said okay. But yeah, it wasn't as simple.
[00:06:57] Sheila Ducksworth: It wasn't as simple as that.
[00:06:58] Ariana Drummond: It wasn't as simple as that.
[00:06:59] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that. But still very great to have supportive people in your life. So I know that you've worked on the studio side, the network side, and then also the production side of the industry, which is, I feel like really rare in this industry.
Was that intentional or was that just a career path that you naturally got to follow?
[00:07:17] Ariana Drummond: So it was always intentional that I get into development.
That was what I came out for. But as things work out, that wasn't my first job. My first job was actually in production.
So I was kind of doing all the things that low level production might do. With the errands and the lunches and the this and the that. And so I did that for two years before I got. I think it was two years before I got my first development job. And then it was a real melding of everything. It was development and it was production.
And I really love that aspect of it, too, I have to say. My first job in development was at a studio, and then my. My job after that was in. At a production company. And that's where I've mostly kind of, you know, kind of put myself. Because what I love about a production company is that you're able to do absolutely anything, anything and everything.
And you have, you know, kind of like your fingers in every single pie imaginable. Because a production company typically doesn't have the same scope and resources as a studio would have. Yeah, you do a little casting, you do a little business affairs, you do a little production, you do a little bit of everything. And I have found that most valuable in my career.
[00:08:37] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that. So speaking of production companies, before the CBS studios and NAACP Ventures, you had your own production company, Ducksworth Production. So what did owning your own production company teach you about the industry that maybe being a studio executive hasn't?
[00:08:53] Ariana Drummond: So I had had great training wheels, I have to say, before I started my own company. And that was one of the things that emboldened me to start company was because I knew how to make it work. And so starting my own thing, it was great because I knew how to put projects together, I knew how to sell them, and I knew how to make them. And those were all the things that I had to do with running my company. And it was really fun. I enjoyed it.
And I actually had no intention of going on to the next thing.
As a matter of fact, I did get a phone call to ask if I wanted to run television for another company.
And I thought, oh, I hadn't thought about stopping.
But, you know, ultimately, all things change. All things, you know, come to pass. And so that one did, too.
[00:09:40] Sheila Ducksworth: And then also, what did it teach you about leading in those specific rooms and pushing maybe creative visions through the systems that aren't always built for women.
[00:09:50] Ariana Drummond: So, you know, I really look at it as, you know, what am I trying to do with this project? What am I trying to say? Yeah, with every project that I'm. That I actually move forward. It's really about, what is the intention of this? This.
[00:10:05] Sheila Ducksworth: Yeah.
[00:10:06] Ariana Drummond: And where do I see it going once I do all the work? And it's a highly collaborative process, so it's with a. With several people usually. But once the work is all done, it's what does this show saying? What does it mean? What will it do? And so that's really important to me. And so I kind of go in somewhat agnostically and say, if I'm going to put my time in this. And it's a lot of time. And then the forethought too, because. Because if you've been doing this a while, you know, it's not just about selling the project, selling the pilot and then making the pilot. It really is something that you have to be able to, you know, live with 24 7, because things happen 24 7. So it's about investing your time in something that you really want to invest in. And so that's how I enter every project that I take on.
Could I see myself getting up Saturday at three in the morning dealing with whatever the case may be?
And that's how I push things forward. I say, this is important. This is something that's never been done. This is something I'd like to see done. And so those are the things that enable me to say, I'm in.
[00:11:16] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that. I love that. So speaking of executive producing, I feel like when people hear of an executive producer, it's just something that maybe people put their name on. But I feel like with beyond the Gate specifically, you guys are pushing out content at such a high level.
And with that being said, can you explain a little bit about maybe, or walk us through what your everyday walk looks like, exactly what you do as an executive producer?
[00:11:39] Ariana Drummond: So I wear a couple of different hats because I am an executive producer on beyond the Gates. And then I'm also putting forth other projects to fall, you know, in the same trajectory as beyond the Gates. As far as beyond the Gates goes, it's a highly intensive, I mean, effort to make all of this happen. And this is me, who's primarily now from Los Angeles.
Once I sold the project and once we got going with it, I did move to Atlanta, which is where we shoot beyond the Gates. And I moved there for about six months. And that was really to get it off the ground to launch it. I had been living with the project as a sold project for about three and a half years before we got the green light.
So it might be helpful to back up and really just say how it did come to be, which was really CBS and I were having a conversation about the CBS Studios NAACP venture and me coming on board.
And I was talking with George Cheeks, who's the chair of TV media at Paramount now and was a CEO and president of CBS at the time, back in 2020.
And so we were talking about things that potentially I could craft, could put together, make and push forward.
And I had let George know. I said, I really am interested in doing all day parts because I have prod all day parts. I've done late night, I've done daytime, I've done obviously prime time.
And so I was very interested in doing that. And George was very.
Just completely supportive. Sure, definitely. And that's what the goal of this whole venture was about. It's about representation on tv. So of course, everyday part. And so then I said, okay, so what I really want to do is daytime amongst all the other things.
And again, complete support.
And then I said, well, what I really, really want to do is a soap opera. And literally I didn't know what was going to come back. I kind of expected who's doing soap operas?
But what came back was we have just been talking about doing a soap opera.
[00:13:59] Sheila Ducksworth: That's incredible.
[00:13:59] Ariana Drummond: It's the most incredible thing. Talk about timing.
And so from there, this was an original premise that I had and had had it for decades. And so I pitched him, I said, well, I actually have the idea. And I pitched him the.
And he said that it would be something that we could explore. So that was the genesis of all of that. I ended up coming on board, taking the job in November of 2020 and really just working, doing all that I could to make this come to fruition. Because once again, it was a longtime dream of mine to make this soap opera.
And so, I mean, there's so many steps in between. But I won't get into every detail.
[00:14:43] Sheila Ducksworth: No, it's way too much.
[00:14:44] Ariana Drummond: It's way too much.
But flash.
So three and a half years later, we did get the green light and it was just absolutely amazing.
[00:14:54] Sheila Ducksworth: And speaking of amazing, I want to get to what people really want to hear is beyond the Gate. So I mean, again, it's the first predominantly black hour long daytime soap opera, but also the first in over 25 years, again, which is historic, incredible. And I don't think people really understand the gravity of what you've accomplished here.
Talk to us a little bit. I mean, you mentioned it a little earlier, but talk to us a little bit about the inspiration behind the series. But also, why do you think it's taken so long to make a black series like this?
[00:15:30] Ariana Drummond: Oh, wow. You know, there's. I can answer that last question fairly easily, which is, I think that people get accustomed to one thing. And so soap operas have been around for almost 100 years between radio and TV, but a very long time. And they were always kind of, you know, shaped in this one form.
And so I think that just in the evolution of it all, it didn't quite evolve. It just kind of gave different aspects, different towns, different families, but very much, you know, similar.
And so, you know, in starting this venture and leading the venture as well as kind of dovetailing it with the projects that are of interest to me, it was just really important that we do something that felt really real and representative of the world.
So while it is a predominantly black soap opera, it truly is there for everybody.
And it was truly set up to be that way.
Watching soap operas as a kid, it wasn't. It was very monolithic.
But my approach to it was really. I wanted it to be very inclusive.
So literally, I'm one of those people that's very methodical, I have to admit. And so I made Once Michelle put. Michelle Valjean is our creator of the soap and we worked together for six months with her doing the lion's share of the work of putting together this bible. And that was part of the process of getting this show to where we are right now. So she took the premise and filled it in with people and professions and all kinds of things. And as we were kind of pulling it all together, I did my charts and I said, okay, so who's single, who's married, who's divorced, who lives inside the gates, who lives outside the gates, who. Who's 70, 60, 50, 40, 30? I mean, it was every single demographic that you could think of. And truly, because I wanted this show to be something that was for everybody so that everybody could see themselves in it.
And fortunately it all worked out. And I feel like we've gotten a lot certainly. I mean, there's an infinite number of lives and lifestyles in the world and we can't capture every single last one of them. But we've made such a great effort and I think that that's what people are really notic and really loving about the show is that they can see themselves. And that was the point.
[00:18:02] Sheila Ducksworth: 100%. 100%. And I love to your point that it is multi generational.
I mean, we're in the second season of the series now and you have got to see the world unfold from the very beginning. What has been one of your favorite storylines within the series that you like to tell?
[00:18:18] Ariana Drummond: You know, it's so interesting because right now the world is seeing about not quite even a year and a half in. I have to say, I love all the storylines, you know, we. And when I say we, there's a group of us, a good number of us, that go through the outlines that the writers put forth and these documents called thrusts, which are a more general form of the outline.
So the written documents go through several phases and, you know, we all just kind of contribute, we all add, we all talk about it, we all collaborate.
And so I really love them all. We have such a top tier cast and top tier writers, just everything, truly, every department. I could talk about the directors, I could talk about the casting, I could talk about our production design, the hair, the makeup, the wardrobe, the glam, the lighting, the. I mean, the music. And see, this is what happens when you start saying things you forget.
But it is truly. It's like an army of 200 people every day marching in lockstep to make the show happen. And it's 24 7. We work every day of the week. When I was talking about just the outlines, I get my outlines, whether they're five of them or six of them, every single Saturday, I get the thrust again, a thrust is a generalized version of the way that we have it set up. It's the following week's creative. After we get the outlines. I get that every Sunday and every Monday the notes are due.
Every Tuesday we talk about it. So, yeah, it's a lot. It is 247 and we cast all the time. We cast a couple people yesterday. I'm sure we'll cast another group of people later on this week.
Kim Coleman and Emily Fleischer do all of our casting day to day and, you know, giving us our folks and our choices, they're incredible. And the amount that they cast, we've only been shooting from a little over a year and a half at this point, and they have cast over 350 people closing in on 400.
[00:20:32] Sheila Ducksworth: But also, look at the. That's amazing because a lot of people are needing work right now. And the fact that you guys are constantly doing it is amazing. So it really is.
[00:20:40] Ariana Drummond: And there's so much talent in Atlanta, I have to say. I've been working in Atlanta now for almost 25 years, back and forth. My residency is obviously in Los Angeles, but I've done reality shows, I've done movies, sitcom, I shouldn't say sitcom, but comedy, drama, and now a soap opera all in Atlanta. And the talent that I've come across, and I will say on both sides of the camera, the talent, you know, in terms of crew. Incredible. And the talent in terms of, you know, just actors and just the raw talent there, as well as the, you know, folks who've been doing this for a very long time. It's really a great place to be and a great place to shoot and we've been able to source some really, really, really wonderful people. I love that.
[00:21:28] Sheila Ducksworth: That's incredible. And I mean, you talked about it a little earlier, but you're taping five days a week.
[00:21:32] Ariana Drummond: Yeah.
[00:21:33] Sheila Ducksworth: Year round. I know that you were saying, look, holidays don't count because we're still working on holidays. And you talked about it being such a well oil machine, which is absolutely incredible. I mean, talk to us a little bit about the, the process of, of having a great team behind you and being able to do this impactful work every day.
[00:21:51] Ariana Drummond: Yeah, well, what I'll say too is that we're not fully around the clock. We do shoot in x excess of 200 shows, but we don't break it across 50 weeks. So our cast gets breaks as well as the crew. So we'll take our dark weeks. As a matter of fact, we have a dark week coming up just this coming week. So we have breaks and so people do get time off.
But the truth is we have just such a great, I just say just level of talent of making this run, of making this go. And so, you know, you know, the most important thing for me when I was first building the soap was really making the best of the best or selecting the best of the best, as far as I saw, was really important for me to build something that was going to last a hundred and plus years. And the way to do that is to build out an A team.
The first person that I went to once we knew that we could make this show and get it, I should say not make the show, but at least get it into back in 2020.
I've had a longstanding relationship with Michelle Valjean. We've known each other for over 20 years. She was my first phone call. My second phone call, which was a couple of years into the development process, was to Bruton Jones, who is our production designer or was our production designer at the time.
He is incredible. We've worked together before and I always measure departments and the running of the departments in the terms of can I sleep at night? And that's how I always think about can. You know, is this the way that we should go? And Bruton and I had worked together and I knew his work and just know him he came in and under the gun in roughly two months, built out 27 sets.
And not easy because, you know, we're over here picking out the, you know, all the flooring and the wallpaper and the colors and every last little thing right there with him. And so he has the patience of the saint.
The third that was really important to me was Kim Coleman, who I mentioned to you before. And I reached out to her a year in advance of us getting a green light because I knew how important it was gonna be for us to get an incredible, incredible cast pulled together.
So none of this we worked on. In fact, they didn't even know what the project was. I just said, I have something and I'm gonna need you. And fortunately, they said that they would come on board. Then once we got our green light, we started hiring so many more people.
Key among amongst them is Julie Carruthers, who has decades and decades and decades of experience in soap opera and in soap opera producing.
And so she was definitely like one of the people that I called. But once I met her, she was the only person that I felt could do this job who moved her life to Atlanta from Los Angeles and is running the whole, whole enterprise of the, all the 200 folks down in Atlanta. And really on top of everything that goes down there, another gentleman, Al Dickerson, is our producer down there as well, who really puts forth so much of the execution of what we're looking to do in our budgeting and all of that. It's a whole lot of folks. Yeah, I mean, the we mentioned before, hair, makeup, wardrobe, Jeresa Featherstone Winfield is one of a kind.
She is a three time Emmy winner.
Amazing with her choices, amazing with putting things together and making them feel that only this character can wear them.
Wonkia Hinkson, who is our hair person, she runs our hair department. She and I have had the benefit of knowing each other for over a decade. This is our third time around the block and I have to say, what she's doing is incredible. And then rounding out the glam squad, obviously, Stevie Martin, who just does makeup like no other. And they all have incredible people and teams behind them that make everything look flawless. The lighting is super important.
Vinny Stib is just one of the best that ever was to do it. He is amazing.
He and Victor Bland, I mean, they are just doing incredible work. And, you know, again, once again, I get into the problem of calling people
[00:26:25] Sheila Ducksworth: out because it's like you're just constantly,
[00:26:28] Ariana Drummond: you can't say everybody, but I will just say suffice. It to say, we have a good 200 people who make it their mission to do the best work that could possibly be done to make the show look the way that it does feel the way that it does. It's incredible and really quick.
[00:26:48] Sheila Ducksworth: I mean, we talked about production design, and when I was on the set again, you were very intentional about, from the portrait to the flooring to the crest, everything. Why was it.
The intentionality behind it, why was that so important to you?
[00:27:02] Ariana Drummond: It was paramount. That's why this was. Once we were underway with our writing of it, the look of it is so important. The production designer is usually one of the first people that I look for and look to bring on board. Because it's a visual world and everything does mean something, or at least everything should mean something. That's how I come to the table with it. And. And so every single little thing we just worked hand in hand to, you know, whatever it was. One of the funny things, I will admit, and I've said it before, so I'll say it here too, is the country club. The country club was our major hub and the focal point of the show. This is the set that sets us and our soap apart from any other soap.
And I really wanted to get it right. Right.
So that meant going down to the DMV area. That meant going down to Maryland, of which I have no memberships of any country clubs of any kind.
So I called a friend of mine that I figured would.
And she was overseas at the time, but she hit me back and she said, just wave driving and wave. They won't stop you. And so I'm giving away the state secrets here because now maybe the next person won't be able to do. But that's exactly what I did. I just went in and just plucked the best of the best. There's some beautiful country clubs down in the.
[00:28:29] Sheila Ducksworth: Yeah, I can only imagine. I'm gonna go.
[00:28:30] Ariana Drummond: But took the best of the best and, you know, and the colors, what we wanted it to look like, because that would really inform what the show, how it felt, you know, and there's so many variations that you could choose. You know, we could choose kind of the staid wood, you know. You know, kind of, you know, club, you know, kind of look of it all or what we went for. Everybody could see it was kind of more of a marine look, something that looked really contemporary with the blues and the yellows. And that's what caught my eye. So gorgeous when I went down there.
[00:29:03] Sheila Ducksworth: So, yeah, it was absolutely gorgeous. And I want to jump really quick to some of the storylines because I feel like some of the storylines have such an extraordinary level of cultural specifics in the episodes or that's built in them. For example, specifically with Banneker University and how it parallels with HBCU culture. And also the inclusion of the cotillion episode, which I loved, was glamorous, but both dramatic, which was, again, amazing. Why do you think it's so important to include these cultural details into the episodes?
[00:29:35] Ariana Drummond: Really important. And I'll just say this, too. I'll give a little tease. We have another one that's coming out that we haven't let folks know about yet, but it will be coming up in the next several months in the last quarter of the year.
[00:29:48] Sheila Ducksworth: I'm excited.
[00:29:48] Ariana Drummond: So, yeah, we have a big, fun one coming.
I love that.
[00:29:53] Sheila Ducksworth: Again, beautiful. I can't say enough.
The wardrobe department is just amazing.
Absolutely incredible.
And then also with the cotillion episode, you took something that has, I guess, traditionally been black tradition and brought into today's context of the storyline today. So how do you make those decisions about when to modernize a tradition versus maybe protecting and keeping as it is?
[00:30:19] Ariana Drummond: So it's all about, with this soap opera, making it feel like it's 21st century. Everything about this soap opera was conceived so that it felt like a breath of fresh air, something that exists in the world today, but we haven't necessarily seen it before.
So we do look to stay contemporary and, you know, in the moment of things that are happening, so that, you know, we impart that to the viewer. So really important. But, yes, these cotillions have been around even prior to 100 years, and it's a worldwide kind of, like, event. It's happened. Cotillions are from. They're centuries old, and they cross all kinds of divides.
But this one, the black cotillion, obviously, has been around starting off in New Orleans over 100 years ago. And it was really important that we shine a light on it, especially, I felt, in daytime. Daytime is just such a special place because you get a dose of life every single day, five days a week, and really live with this family and live with what they're doing. And so I did feel like the deprive of all people would be heavily ensconced in, you know, culture, of course. And so I was really grateful and really pleased with when everybody just got on board and said, let's. Let's make a cotillion. And we made a cotillion.
[00:31:47] Sheila Ducksworth: You did, baby. It was beautiful.
And I Want to talk a little bit also about the crossover episode. So I've been, again, a fan of or I started off in soap operas watching Young and the Restless because I was like, even again, the crossover episode was absolutely amazing. I was reading something the other day that it averaged over 1.8 million viewers, which is amazing.
With the success of the episode, do you think we can expect some future crossovers?
[00:32:15] Ariana Drummond: You know, I would just always say expect the unexpected.
I will say that because we are consistently. The one thing that we do is try to outdo ourselves. I love that. And everybody. It's not just when I say us and outdo ourselves, it's everybody. Everybody takes it to the next level. And that's the thing that makes the show so great. I've said it before and I'll say it again. Again, people have said what separates the show from others.
And I always say it's the people, because the people are the people or the things I should say that make this whole thing run. It's the people that go the extra mile, and in this case, even beyond who? You know, it's funny because last two weeks ago when I was in Atlanta and I was just showing some people around, and nobody was in the hair and makeup, which is extraordinarily rare, nobody was in the hair and makeup room. And literally, I said, they're all out on stage making sure that this is in place, this is in place, this is in place. And that was in the afternoon. And so from the time that they start, which is 6 or 6:30, and then until the time that we end, which could be 6:30, 7, 7, 8, 9, whatever, we end the day, they're consistently and constantly out making sure that this is the best looking show that we could possibly make. And so literally every department head and person is of the same mindset. And that's what gives us such a great show.
[00:33:46] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that. That's beautiful. And I mean, just speaking of the people on episodes I know, again, soap operas are supposed to be full of twists and turns, and beyond the Gates really holds true to that, which, again, I love.
You know, the episodes are so raw and authentic and shocking, which, again, they're supposed to be, which I wasn't expecting just recently, was that steamy makeout session between Dani and Bill, which I'm like, I'm gonna take a huge leap and just be like, you know, can we might expect a baby on the way or, you know, not giving too much away. No, I'm just playing.
[00:34:19] Ariana Drummond: But I was like, I love that scene.
[00:34:21] Sheila Ducksworth: So they are literally my favorite couple. So I'm like, okay, I. I wasn't expecting that.
[00:34:26] Ariana Drummond: But, yeah, well, that's the writers. I mean, everybody has their lane. And I have to say, the writers will take you in this lane, twist into that way, turn into this one. They're just really incredible with the stories that they come up with. I can't wait for people to truly see what happens over the course of this year.
[00:34:47] Sheila Ducksworth: I'm excited.
[00:34:48] Ariana Drummond: This whole year is just fire.
We started off with the cancer storyline and built into the blood plasma ring and the cotillion and the crossover. And a big shout out to the marketing department at cbs. Mike Benson is amazing. And I just have to say, I mean, this crossover was everything that we envisioned to the Young and the Restless folks. Everybody there who just, you know, came down to Atlanta, you know, rolled up their sleeves to figure out how to make it all work. I mean, it was a huge effort bringing together both of these companies. I can only imagine making this whole thing happen. Yeah. And the people who were there on stage who actually put in the work and actually made all of that happen. And it was just really incredible.
And then now the aftermath of, you know, the whole fallout from the tornado.
[00:35:37] Sheila Ducksworth: I mean, I know I was like, my poor girl.
[00:35:39] Ariana Drummond: Oh, my goodness.
Look, look, I know.
[00:35:42] Sheila Ducksworth: I hope she's good. I think. I don't know if I was. I was. I literally. I haven't caught up fully, but I know the other day I was watching the episode of her being in hospital a bit and her finally saying, agreeing to, you know, the surgery. So I'm like, okay, you better save my girl now. We can't be doing her like that. So.
[00:35:58] Ariana Drummond: Well, that's the great thing about soaps, too, is that we try to present
[00:36:02] Sheila Ducksworth: both sides of it, which I can understand.
[00:36:05] Ariana Drummond: So you'll see both sides of pretty much everything in our storylines.
But, you know, it's just gonna be incredible what's coming up in the second half of the year. I mean, I'm just gonna say, everybody just buckle up. Okay? Look, it is some good stuff. I love that. It's really great.
[00:36:23] Sheila Ducksworth: And then just speaking of sur.
Has there been something crazy that. Or your favorite twist or turn thus far? Anything crazy that you like?
[00:36:32] Ariana Drummond: Gosh, there's so many twists. Yeah, there's so many twist and turns, I have to say.
Gosh, you know, the very first one was before we even started shooting. The very first one was what was in the Bible, which was the character Leslie played by Trisha. Man, Grant coming to Take.
So that was the first one. And I said, oh, we're on from here, so. Oh, my gosh. And it's been, you know, as I said, expect the unexpected. So it's really been terrific.
[00:37:01] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that. I love that we talk a lot in these conversations about the importance of representation both in front of and behind the screen. So what does having a black woman at the helm as an executive producer and also the president of this production company change about what actually makes it into screen?
[00:37:19] Ariana Drummond: You know, we all have just such different perspectives and points of view.
It really is a group effort of what the world will see when they're consuming the show.
But it's great to be able, and I really consider it both an honor and a privilege to be able to, you know, throw out storylines, throw out ideas that people will see, not just here and the States, but, you know, all over the world, seeing things, lives and lifestyles that maybe they're familiar with, but maybe they're not at all. And then for people who live abroad, people that, you know, we're a global show, and for people to be able to see that people like the Duprees and the people in this whole world really do exist, it's just an incredible.
I think it's a. It's an incredible honor to be able to bring that forth and show the world what really does exist.
[00:38:16] Sheila Ducksworth: I love that because to your point, it's so collaborative, but also, it's probably the first time that maybe people are seeing African Americans in a certain light. And to see it in such a positive light, like, hey, we're. We're. We're not a monolith. We're able to, you know, be in these wealthy situations. And we're different people and different folks. And I love the fact that you guys are bringing that on screen, which is such a beautiful thing to see.
[00:38:40] Ariana Drummond: Yeah, that was always the intention. And when I talk about the mission of the show, that is the mission of the show. It really just to show the different perspectives that exist in this world. And the flip side of it, the part B of it is hopefully it'll just promote change in a way that we haven't seen before, because people haven't experienced certain things. And so it really is twofold in what we're putting forth and what we anticipate getting back from what they view with the show.
[00:39:11] Sheila Ducksworth: I wanna pivot a little bit to. Again, the purpose of this podcast is really to provide people with resources on how to break into the industry. Industry. So if someone is watching this Right now and wants to be a TV producer, whether that's scripted or unscripted. What is the biggest misconception of an executive producer?
[00:39:27] Ariana Drummond: I would say that an executive producer has to be prepared to do anything and everything. Yeah. That it's not just a. I mean, certainly, yes, it. You can take a passive role as one type of producer, but I think that the really successful ones have a real, really wide range of experiences and know how to do a wide range of things. So it isn't just about, you know, just doing one thing. It's about doing many, many things. I'd also say it's important for someone to realize that the kind of producer that I am, too, that it really is a physical job. It's not about just sitting down and, you know, flipping pages or even watching the cuts. It's about actually being proactive and figuring things out and trying to solve problems.
And when I am on set, being on set, trying to figure out, okay, what is the best way for us to get to where we want to be or, you know, for us to get over this hump that we've now encountered today. Because that's the thing. There's always something that goes on, right or wrong, in productions. And so it really is about fixing them and addressing them.
And it truly is a physical job.
But physical, it's mental. It's really all the things. And certainly in the history of all producers, you can kind of choose your lane and figure out, well, I only want to do this or I only want to do that.
But if we're talking about being a successful producer and being able to anticipate and expect and execute, I would say that it requires a lot of thinking ahead. I'll tell you, even with this show, we have. Have the great benefit of having Procter and Gamble as partners.
And so in that kind of wilderness of, okay, we're going to explore this show, but we haven't gotten the green light yet. So in those three and a half years, every single day was just pushing a boulder up a hill in that it's not. And not in a negative way at all. It's just a lot of effort. It takes a lot. And this particularly took a lot because. Because people thought that soap operas were dead and that they were not coming back. So to get a new one was just incredible. And I think that people have definitely conveyed that to, I can't believe that there's a new soap on.
But I have to say, it really is about being anticipatory. So I knew with this being a rarity and kind of like, we have this one shot to make this happen. It was really about anticipating every step of the way. So it's like, okay, what is Procter and Gamble going to be asking for in the next six months? And how can I get over that before we get on top of it? And that's exactly how you have to think. Once you stop momentum on something, sometimes it's really hard to get it back. And I didn't want for this to be one of those times. And so there were many, many more junctures than I could ever possibly tell you in this little bit of time that we have. But there were so many junctures along the way that required thinking ahead and thinking, how do I get to.
How do I solve this problem before we even get to it? And so it inquire. It required quite a bit, you know, thinking out of the box and hiring a consultant here and getting budgets made here and, you know, putting together, like mood reels and all kinds of things that would enhance us getting to where we are now. So it requires a lot of foresight and a lot of forethought and a lot of.
I love that.
[00:43:17] Sheila Ducksworth: And, you know, as we wrap, you talked about the mission of this series a hundred years from now, when television historians are writing about beyond the gates and in this era of storytelling right now, and they get to the chapter, what do you want them to take away from beyond the Gates?
[00:43:34] Ariana Drummond: Oh, wow, that's such a great question too, because there's so many things. But the biggest thing, perhaps I would say, is that, you know, that although fictional, these people lived, that we leave a sociological footprint, that this was a reality at this point in time. And this is how they live, this is how they move. This is how they talked, this is what they wore. So I want there to be that. That presence when people look at it, you know, and come to 2025 when we first launched. And I always say that this show is going to go for 100 plus years and it will. That is, let's speak it into existence.
But I always say that because that's the desire from the very beginning, that was always the goal. The goal was always to build something that would last and something that made a difference.
And I have to say, I'm just so grateful that we're even here at this point, that we're a year and almost a half into the realization of all that.
[00:44:36] Sheila Ducksworth: And just speaking about the importance of this series, somewhere out there right now, a black girl is watching beyond the gates. What do you want her to know? Not just about the show, but what's possible for her.
[00:44:46] Ariana Drummond: Gosh, can I just broaden that and say for anybody, for anybody. And I would just say that all things are possible.
All things are possible. And to have the faith and have the confidence and have the drive, because it is not possible without the work. It's a lot of work.
[00:45:03] Sheila Ducksworth: Faith without works is dead.
[00:45:04] Ariana Drummond: Okay, that's exactly right. And so it's. But all things are possible. And so to dream big and don't put a cap on your dream because, you know, don't say it didn't happen now, so it'll never happen.
This happened out of a conversation. The confluence of events, you know, is only, you know, it's written in the stars. Because it's so much that happened to make this work.
And I will say this, too, that it also didn't just happen because I thought of the idea five minutes before I walked into, you know, a meeting or got on a zoom.
It's something that I've kind of lived with and baked and thought over and over again, wouldn't it be great? And it could be like this or it could be like that. And I had kind of worked out, you know, some of the things that kind of pointed me in the direction of this big sprawling family in the DMV area that lived, you know, in a. In a gated community with a country club and a golf course. So it was years and decades of activity, thinking it over and even pitching parts of it over the course. I've been developing now for over 30 years. So pitching parts and part and parcel of it, but, you know, for it all to come together the way that it did at this point in time, there are so many people that make the show go. I mentioned George Cheeks, Amy Reisenbach, who's the president of cbs, David Staff, who's the president of the studio, all the departments that exist under the studio and the network, Brian Rubin, the cfo, the whole BA department, Brian Smith, who literally figured out how to make deals on a Soap Opera in 2024. At the time, for 2025, there's just so many people that made this work.
And that's what I mean by when I say lightning in a bottle. People wanted to make this happen. People thought that it was time that we had a daily dose of a life such as this and a life well lived such as this every single day. And I will say, for 100 plus years, we're speaking it.
[00:47:14] Sheila Ducksworth: We're speaking it. Oh, My goodness, this has been such an incredible conversation. And before we officially wrap, I do want to play a quick game with you. It's called inside your industry bag. It's not exactly a bag, but if you look into the cup to your left, you'll notice a quick prompt. If you want to take one of those out, read the question and answer it. Feel free. If you don't like it, you can pick another. It's nothing crazy.
[00:47:37] Ariana Drummond: I might have to pick another. But I might not. I might not.
Okay. Oh, interesting.
[00:47:44] Sheila Ducksworth: You can pick another.
[00:47:46] Ariana Drummond: I don't mind taking the first one. Okay. It's okay.
When was the last time you doubted yourself?
[00:47:52] Sheila Ducksworth: That's good.
[00:47:52] Ariana Drummond: That's an interesting question planted right there at the top.
Here's the thing. I don't think that you ever. No one is a machine. I don't think that you. You ever don't doubt something. But the important thing is to overcompensate when you do doubt yourself. Believe in yourself. Believe in yourself. Have the confidence and say, I'm gonna do it anyhow. And so I'd say that doubt is a normal emotion that we all have, amongst many things, like, should I have eaten that cookie? Hello.
Lots of things. I doubt it. Oh, I love you. But I have to say, you know, it just exists. But it's not about the doubt.
And again, across any scenario, it really is about overcoming that and excelling beyond that. That's the key that will get you to where you want to go, is put the doubt aside and really take some time. Think about it, meditate. Is this really what I want to do? How do I want to do it? When do I want to do it and actually just. Just do it. I can't say enough that it really does come down to the work and really putting all the pieces together to make your dream come true. I love that.
[00:49:13] Sheila Ducksworth: Achille, thank you so much for dropping by and just dropping some amazing gems for our viewers today and then also just spilling a little bit of tea.
Not a whole bunch, but spinning a little bit of tea about beyond the gates. So thank you. We appreciate it.
[00:49:24] Ariana Drummond: You're very welcome.
[00:49:26] Sheila Ducksworth: I hope you enjoyed today's episode. No matter where you are. The in your journey, we're here to be a resource. If this conversation sparks something special for you, make sure to, like, subscribe and share and drop a comment letting us know what conversations you'd like to see next. I'm your host, Ariana Drummond. See you inside the industry.
